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Failed System Of Socialism
  
RichardC:

Identity politics? Tribalism? That's exactly what Republican "build the wall!" xenophobia is all about!


David:

You wrote: Look at the housing projects, a microcosm of the socialist society. Do you folks who believe in socialism, think this example is proof of success or failure?

Which would you prefer? A bunch of people living in run-down housing projects, or those same people sleeping on the street and eating out of garbage cans?


Fire At The Notre Dame
  
jerry6593:

kathr4453 wrote: Shame on you, as a Chriatian.
You wrote: What is a Chriatian? Did someone leave the door to your padded room open?

Minor typos, spelling mistakes, grammar errors, etc. just prove that people are human. Everybody makes them, even you. If you don't want to be ridiculed over your own minor mistakes, you should probably avoid ridiculing others over theirs. You know, the whole "love your neighbor as yourself", "do unto others as you would have them do unto you", and "remove the beam from your own eye before criticizing the speck in your brothers'" things, that Jesus actually taught.


Failed System Of Socialism
  
Nicole_Lacey:

Republicans (big "champions of states' rights") refuse states' rights to legalize medical cannabis despite its proven benefits.

Trump only switched to Republican because he thought Republicans would be more likely to like him.

Sometimes the rules are manipulated by evil people towards evil ends. Republicans deliberately gerrymander districts so they can win with only 30% of the popular vote. Hitler was legally elected to rule Germany. "by peace shall destroy many" (Daniel 8:25) is using the rules for a bad end. Republicans are passing laws that legally take away millions of people's health cares, which WILL kill thousands.


Fire At The Notre Dame
  
Nicole_Lacey:

You wrote: Obama and Hillary called them 'Easter Worshippers'.

When English language prepositions are omitted, one is expected to use common sense to figure out what is missing. I find it astounding that so many people are capable of common-sense language use everywhere in their lives EXCEPT when discussing theology or Biblical interpretation.

"Olive oil" means "oil FROM olives" but "Baby oil" means "Oil FOR babies".

"Easter Worshiper" means "People who worship ON Easter" (instead of staying home), not "People who WORSHIP Easter", just as "Sunday Worshiper" and "Saturday Worshiper" say WHEN people worship.


Jesus With Taxes
  
There is no record of Jesus ever refusing to pay tax, or teaching others to do so. That would be disobedience against higher authorities, whom Jesus taught us to obey (i.e. "Render unto Caesar what is Caesar's").

However, accusing someone of terribly unpopular crimes has always been a popular way to eliminate unpopular people, even if accusations weren't true. Corrupt officials in Salem accused innocent women of witchcraft so they could kill them and seize their land.

French King Philip IV, deeply in debt, accused the Knights Templar of satanism so he could have them killed and seize their lands.

The Pharisees encouraged the crowd to accuse Jesus of tax evasion (i.e. treason) as an excuse to have him killed.


Failed System Of Socialism
  
jerry6593:

I don't complain about which days are kept - that's YOUR beef.

Note that in Rome emperors issued edicts, over which citizens had NO control.

In America, the PEOPLE vote for representatives, and those representatives, who (allegedly) represent the will of the PEOPLE enact the laws that the PEOPLE have empowered them to enact. If you don't like the laws that they enact, you have only yourselves to blame.

I also find it curious that whenever Congress passes laws Republicans love, they extol the Democratic process, but when it passes laws they hate, they whine about tyranny. Compare how Trump hated the Electoral College, but suddenly loved it when it handed him the Presidency.


Might Have Autism
  
john9346:

I read what I wrote when I wrote it. If you have a complaint about something I said, please ACTUALLY QUOTE what I said, rather than making vague allegations. Whenever someone makes an accusation, THEY must prove it, not require the accused to prove themselves innocent.

You keep making allegations about my "World View" that you concoct in your head, without actually proving that I have such a "World View".

You keep self-righteously telling me to "repent of my sin", yet you are totally oblivious to your own.


Failed System Of Socialism
  
RichardC:

You wrote: Were has Socialism ever work ? Norway, Ireland, New Zealand etc, are market economy's with social programs, most heavily tax

This is the whole disingenuous "apples and oranges" argument from the right - when Norway wants to do it, they're careful to say "But that isn't socialism" but when America wants to do exactly the same thing, they call it "EVIL SOCIALISM!"

Collectivism eventually leads to, death, destruction, coercion, tyranny

The early church was 100% collectivist, pooling all their resources, with no private ownership. Were they wrong?


Might Have Autism
  
john9346:

Yes, they DO clarify my world view. I NEVER said I don't believe scripture, and I NEVER said I don't believe in right or wrong. If I have EVER said any of these things, SHOW ME WHERE. Otherwise STOP repeating lies.

Yes, true scripture is theopneustos, but how do YOU know that the scripture YOU have in your hands is actually a 100% accurate representation of that original inspired scripture? We have many manuscripts of scripture, and they differ in minor ways. How do you know which of those is actually the REAL one? By scholarly analysis - which is based on extra-scriptural HUMAN WISDOM.

"YOU do not believe in Scripture."

I never said that, so why do YOU keep saying it?


Failed System Of Socialism
  
john9346, jerry6593:

I said early Christians held things in common by CHOICE. They weren't ALL in agreement. See Ananias and Sapphira. Yes, they lied, but that wouldn't have happened if they didn't disagree, and didn't feel pressured to conform).

Choices made by our country are made by our ELECTED REPRESENTATIVES. I find it amazing how Republicans gloat over Trump's victory and tell Democrats to "live with it", requiring us to like electoral choices that go their way, while simultaneously disavowing responsibility for electoral choices that don't.

I didn't say socialist GOVERNMENT. I said socialist POLICIES like welfare and health care. Stop blaming me for YOUR inability to read.


Might Have Autism
  
john9346:

1. I have NEVER said that I don't believe in the Bible.
2. I have NEVER said that I don't believe in right or wrong.

You make incorrect inferences by taking the things I say, and taking them totally out of context and making incorrect assumptions based totally on your own perceptions.

3. I DO want you to believe what I ACTUALLY write. I DON'T want you to believe in things I never wrote but are merely products of your own deluded imagination.

4. There is no question about believing what God ACTUALLY SAID. However, how do you KNOW with 100% certainty that the Bible manuscripts we have now are 100% accurate transcriptions of what God said?


Failed System Of Socialism
  
jerry6593:

You wrote: Your FALSE PREMISE that you want the good form of socialism - not the bad - ignores the reality that ALL socialism requires the breaking of the Christian proscription against stealing and coveting.

You forget that the early church kept ALL THINGS IN COMMON with no private ownership - not only socialism, but outright communism. They did this by mutual agreement.

We elect our government representatives, so if they enact socialist policies like welfare and health care, they do so WITH OUR PERMISSION AND AUTHORITY.

You hate that. You would have REALLY hated the early church!

You don't like covetousness? That's what hoarding wealth is.


Might Have Autism
  
john9346:

You wrote: strongaxe: All World Views are narrow that why everyone has one...

That's true, but what does that have to do with what we have been discussing? How does it justify your taking one comment I made, misinterpreting it, and then constructing an entirely incorrect world view in your mind that you think I have - and then use your own misinterpretation of my beliefs to justify your not justifying your claims on other subjects? You do this over and over again.


Might Have Autism
  
john9346:

Be reasonable. Use the same common sense that EVERYONE uses for EVERYTHING else in their life.

If you read the statement THAT YOU QUOTED, I said that our faith is based on other people's beliefs - I did NOT say that our faith is nonexistent.

"Not being 100% sure of something" is NOT the same as "not believing in it at all". There are many things in life that we trust, even if we do not trust them 100%. When I go into the hospital for surgery, I trust the doctor to do his job, even though I am not 100% sure I will wake up again.

So stop taking words I actually said and then twisting them to mean the exact opposite.


Suffer In Hell Forever
  
mike:

Steveng was the one who talked about "dogmas of a denomination" - Cluny was just quoting him to challenge that statement (exactly as you are doing, but at least he's challenging the right person).

Please state EXACTLY which "Word or commandment of God" that Cluny calls "dogmas of a denomination". Please state EXACTLY how Cluny "rejected and mocked" the commandment and word of God. If you make accusations, you have to be able to back them up.


Might Have Autism
  
john9346:

I said I don't believe in Sola Scriptura. I did NOT say I don't believe in Scripture or right or wrong. You pull those things out of thin air based on your own narrow world view.

Abraham didn't believe in Sola Scriptura (because there was not even any scripture then). Does that mean he didn't believe in right or wrong?

Human societies throughout history have had strongly codified sets of laws, deliniating right and wrong, and only a small number of those were Christian or biblically based.

Also, whether anyone else believes in a book has no bearing on whether a statement is in that book or not. Whether anyone believes the Bible or not, they can say for a fact that Jesus never mentioned LGBT. Prove me wrong.


Suffer In Hell Forever
  
mike:

You wrote: cluny - your favorite verse is what the serpent said in the garden - 'you will not die, you will be like God knowing what is good & evil'. disobedience because you are the one who thinks you are God defining what is good or what is evil'

How could you possibly know what Cluny's favorite verse is? Again, you are totally making things up about people, and then accusing them of it. Do you know what that's called? It's called "bearing false witness". I seem to recall that there's a commandment against that in the Bible somewhere. Perhaps you've heard of it.


Failed System Of Socialism
  
RichardC:

Yes, and if you actually do the math, that's the average tax rate you would end up with with a marginal tax bracket at the high end - the AVERAGE tax rate for one's entire income would be closer to 40%. If you look at Bernie Sanders' proposal, the tax rate is 10% up to to $20K, 15% up to $75K, and 33% up to $250K - just like the current tax rate. It only starts to ramp up higher for people who make over $250K. Nobody who makes over $250K will starve because they pay $80K in taxes.

The reason people can't afford to live in California, NYC, and other large cities isn't because of high taxes - it's because expenses like rent, etc. are astronomically high.


Suffer In Hell Forever
  
mike:

You wrote: it's obvious who you really are obeying. for you glory to the pope not the word of God.

Why do you keep mentioning the Pope? How many times does Cluny have to say that he's Orthodox AND NOT CATHOLIC for people to understand that?

How can you possibly argue against what people say, when you don't even LISTEN to what they say in the first place?



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