ChristiaNet MallWorld's Largest Christian MallChristian BlogsFree Bible QuizzesFree Ecards and Free Greeting CardsLoans, Debt, Business and Insurance Articles

David's Blog Replies
Post a New Blog

Vote on David as a helpful ChristiaNet blogger by clicking this link. Currently David has 139 votes. The higher the number of votes the more helpful this blogger is considered by the ChristiaNet community.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
Isn't repentance and being baptized saving yourself?Kathrine

Let me try to clear things up for you. Your teachers have got things all muddled up. I blame your teachers, not you, for believing as you do. But you will pay the same penalty, so listen.

When we Repent and are baptized we then receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. We are not saved when we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit, as you believe. We are saved, when we are born of the Spirit. Many folks receive this gift, but very few are born of the spirit. (Matthew 22:14)

The reason why, is probably because they all believe just as you do. What is the sign given, so we will know we have been born of the Spirit?(1 John 3:9-10)

Christians Sell Cigarettes
Over the years you have been very helpful in my understanding the foundation of many false doctrines. Though you may fight and squabble amongst yourselves, doctrines like yours are founded on saving oneself. Which is why I showed you (Acts 2:38).

I honestly didnt know, folks believed they were saved, when they received the gift of the Holy Spirit. That was an Eye opening revelation for me. You gave me another way to reveal the false doctrine, to those who believe as you do. And again I thank you. And Hopefully someday, you will be able to thank me when you can read (Acts 2:38), and see the truth in what I have shown you.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
How was I not truthful? I don't know her heart, and neither do you.---StrongAxe

Let me rephrase the question, with your comment I believe you may have misunderstood what I was asking. Kathrine believes she is saved, and has stated so many times. She has also stated, that she had sinned after she was saved. You have never made these claims, and this is why you were not my example.

According to what Jesus taught in (John 8:34) and in (1 John 3:9-10), is she saved? Now before you answer, remember, Jesus is a teacher, the master teacher. Some of the things he taught were in parable, but most of the gospel teachings are not. A teaching taught by a master teacher, is taught so even fools like us can understand.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
I got the answer I expected. I was checking to see if we could have a constructive conversation, but just wanted to check first. And by your answer, you showed me you can not be truthful in our discussion. But then again, if you answered it truthfully, Kathrine would now be spewing lies about you instead of me. Which is another clue according to (Revelation 21:8).

So I will try another one.
Do you believe what John said in (1 John 1: 9-10)KJV?
Yes or No.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
What, exactly did Jesus teach, that I don't believe? Be specific. In particular, which "doctrines" of mine contradict John 8:34-35?---StrongAxe

Jesus taught in those verses, those who sin are slaves and the slave has not been accepted as a permanent member of the family of God, AKA saved. Kathrine claims to be saved and yet she sins, when Jesus calls her a slave of sin.

Do you believe Kathrine is saved?

(Matthew 5:37) All you need to say is simply Yes or No, anything beyond this comes from the evil one.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
You'll never know the damage done to those told .." If you don't speak in tongues you are not saved". Another EXPERIENCE damaging scenario---kathr4453

Oh and dont forget the one your doctrine teaches, That we are saved when we receive the Gift of the Holy Spirit. The gift, Peter taught we receive when we repent and are baptized.

So if we repent and are baptized, according to your doctrine, we can save ourselves if we do these things. Which is a clear and dangerous teaching of works.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
Nowhere does the bible say we are saved through experience.---StrongAxe

Its there, but since you havent experienced Pauls testimony in (Romans 7: 7-25), you dont see it. This is an experience of how the saved, died to sin. Its my experience, but you must experience it to see it.

Sin is a sign of the unsaved, not the sign of the saved. The problem is, you say you believe in Jesus, yet you dont believe what he taught. Here is just one example where Jesus lied according to your doctrines.

(John 8:34-35) Jesus replied, Very truly I tell you, everyone who sins is a slave to sin. Now a slave has no permanent place in the family, but a son belongs to it forever.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
My point is, subjective experience is no guarantee of correctness.---StrongAxe

Subjective experience?
Do you see Pauls testimony in (Romans 7) as a subjective experience too?

The problem though, in understanding Pauls testimony, Paul was educated in the Law, so his speak is different than the common man. He is like a Harvard Law professor trying to explain physics to a 10 year old.
And if he was hard to understand in his day, the only hope we have in understanding him, is through our spiritual experience.

Paul gives a spot on experience, as to the stages we go through when we die to sin, and what we must go through to live for God. If your experience doesnt match his, you are on the wrong path.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
Brother, You got me to thinking.
I have proven to Atheists the existence of God, through the experience one has after a confession of sin.

These folks did not have the gift of the Holy Spirit before they did this, and yet their experience of forgiveness and cleansing promised in (1 John 1: 8 & 9), was the same as mine. I did not know these folks, so I could not follow their progress.

Causes me to wonder, if their experience was God keeping a promise, or did they receive the Holy Spirit when they did this? Hmmm
If ye then, being evil, know how to give good gifts unto your children: how much more shall your heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to them that ask him?
(Luke 11:13)

Christians Sell Cigarettes
I received the Holy Spirit through the instruction given in (Acts 2:38). I was baptized, but did not repent until some 15 years later. And that, is when I received the gift of the Holy Spirit.

How did I know?
When I received the gift, I knew sin where there was no sin. I could actually see evil for the first time in my life, in me, and in the world around me.

Being like an infant in this new experience, I didnt understand or even know it was the Holy Spirit. To be honest, It seemed more a curse at the time and for the next 15 years, until I learned the power of daily confession. After that, I was born of God about 6 months later.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
and all the world may become guilty before God. (Romans 3:19)

Those who have received Gods Holy Spirit, can tell the difference between Guilt before God and Peer Pressure.

But you make a good point, If someone has not received the gift of the Holy Spirit, maybe they dont know the difference. I just assumed this being a Christian blog, Janet was a Christian and has the Holy Spirit to guide her.

Or are you saying you have difficulty discerning between the two? If so, if you feel the need to confess said sin, that is guilt before God.

Christians Sell Cigarettes
Do feel guilty when you sell cigarettes?
Guilt is a sign from God, a sign which tells us when we do wrong. I think every Christian deals with a question like this from time to time.

And though many dont realize it, God has written his commandments upon our hearts and we will feel guilt when we break them.
Therefore by the deeds of the law, no flesh shall be justified in His sight, for by the law is the knowledge of sin. (Romans 3:20)

Guilt is a clear indication when we have broken Gods Law.
Now we know that whatsoever things the law saith, it saith to those who are under the law, that every mouth may be stopped and all the world may become guilty before God.
(Romans 3:19)

Works Of The Law
The original text of Romans 2:7 does not say "He will give you eternal life" if you do this or that.---kathr4453

(Romans 2:6-7)...God, who will render to every man according to his deeds: To them who by patient continuance in well doing seek for glory and honour and immortality,....eternal life:

Thought maybe everyone should look at this verse themselves and see if what Kathrine said was true...or false. As you can see it does say he will give us eternal life if we continue in well Doing.

Well doing is obviously not a thought but an action one takes because they love their neighbor, those Deeds mentioned in vs 6.

Works Of The Law
However I believe the KJV.....---kathr4453

You believe the KJV? If this is true, why do you not accept the following scriptures as worded in the KJV?

(1 John 3:9) KJV says.... Whosoever is born of God doth not commit sin, for his seed remaineth in him: and he cannot sin, because he is born of God.
(Romans 2:13) For it is not the hearers of the law who are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
(Romans 2: 5 & 6)...God,...will render to every man according to his deeds

And many, many, many more to come...

Works Of The Law
(John 14:23)Jesus replied, Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.

And how do we receive the Lords commands?

(John 14:26)
But the Advocate, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, will teach you all things and will remind you of everything I have said to you.

What are the results for those who follow the Lords Commands?

(Romans 2:6 & 7)
God will repay each person according to what they have done. To those who by persistence in doing good seek glory, honor and immortality, he will give eternal life.

Hinduism for some, Christianity for others.

Works Of The Law
David seems to separate being given the Holy Spirit as something different than being Born Again.---kathr4453

Exactly, I do not equate being given the gift of the Holy Spirit with being born again. Many folks, unknowingly believe as you do, that they can save themselves. Sure you teach against it, because you claim to follow Paul and Paul teaches we can not be saved by what we do.

But if we are saved when we receive the Holy Spirit, (Acts 2:38) clearly teaches we can save ourselves when we repent and are baptized. For when we do these two things, we receive the gift of the Holy Spirit. Or is that a false teaching too?

Works Of The Law
You foolish person, do you want evidence that faith without deeds is useless? Was not our father Abraham considered righteous for what he did when he offered his son Isaac on the altar? You see that his faith and his actions were working together, and his faith was made complete by what he did. (James 2:20-22)

As you can see, Jesus and Paul are both in my corner.

Jesus replied, Anyone who loves me will obey my teaching. My Father will love them, and we will come to them and make our home with them.
(John 14:23)

No. 2 was meant to say, those you receive through the Holy Spirit.

Works Of The Law
We must receive the gift of the Holy Spirit (Acts 2:38)

Live in obedience to the Lords commands, those you recipient through the Holy Spirit. (Romans 2:5-7)

No. 3
When you sin, and you will, until such time when you are born again, confess your sins before God. And because of the acceptable sacrifice of Jesus Christ, God will forgive you of the confessed sins and the Blood of his Son will wash your sins away. (1 John 1:7-9)

No. 4
This obedience will bring you into a relationship with God, and through that relationship you grow in his favor and he will decide when and if you will be saved.(John 14:21-23)

Works Of The Law
I am constantly saying on these blogs that all truth is established by two or three witnesses.- -StrongAxe

Saying and doing are two different things. For example, Paul does teach, Not by Works but by Grace, but you claim this means Works plays no role in our salvation. Can you show me a second witness, for that teaching?

Personally...I like you, so though its easy to get riled by what I say, I am not saying it out of spite, but because I care.

Copyright© 2017 ChristiaNet®. All Rights Reserved.