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Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
Ruben:

You asked: So where will our works go thru fire?

Hebrews 9:27 says:
"And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment"

We live our lives, and once we die, our lives are judged by God.

There are many places in scripture that talk about people being rewarded according to their works. (One's works cannot be properly judged until they are complete.)

Matthew 16:27
"For the Son of man shall come in the glory of his Father with his angels, and then he shall reward every man according to his works."

Also Jeremiah 25:14, Proverbs 24:12, 2 Corinthians 11:15, Revelation 2:23, Revelation 20:12-13


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

Extrapolation can sometimes be dangerous, as it relies on subjective thinking, which may be wrong. Many (including some here) are like Superman, leaping over tall buildings to incorrect conclusions. Many cults result from one person extrapolating an entire bizarre theology by incorrectly extrapolating one verse.

You have it reversed. Obedience doesn't free us from sin. Freedom from slavery to sin enables us to obey.

1 Corinthians 3:8-15 talks about our works being judged by fire.

15 If any man's work shall be burned, he shall suffer loss: but he himself shall be saved, yet so as by fire.

I.e. people who are saved, yet their disobedient works are destroyed by fire.


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

You wrote: and yet you say obedience is not required to be a slave of righteousness. How did you become a slave of righteousness without obedience?

I don't understand why you (and Trav) keep putting words in my mouth that I never said.

I never said "obedience is not required". I said that we aren't SAVED by obedience. These are two totally different things.


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

As I have said earlier, when we are saved, we are freed from SLAVERY to sin. Sin no longer RULES our lives. This does not mean that we are incapable of it, just that we're no longer bound by it. Per 1 John 1, if we do occasionally sin, God forgives us. This does not mean that we should sin habitually (Paul dealt with this elsewhere, and sadly, there are many Christians that don't get this, feeling free to sin as they please, and using prayer and confession as a magic "get out of consequences and guilt free" card to let them get away with anything.)


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
Trav:

We were talking about Paul's conversion, so I would have expected that with your abundant knowledge of scripture, you would have the sense to read the part of Acts that actually deals with that, but I guess I needed to be more specific. Sigh. Acts 9.

Act 1:16Men and brethren, this scripture must needs have been fulfilled, - - -
One doesnt have to go very far in acts to find who is being spoke too.


OT scripture was written by and about and to descendents of Israel. Acts 1:16 SPECIFICALLY referred to Pentecost, as only Jesus' apostles and other disciples were present (who were mostly, if not all, Jews).

You have NEVER posted ANY scripture that shows that the "Nth house" accepted Jesus.


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

By rejecting anyone who is in a denomination, by saying that your way of following Christ is better than theirs, aren't YOU guilty of exactly the same kind of "dividing Christ" that you accuse them of?

To your question: God chooses whom to call to him, but they have the choice whether to accept or reject that call.


Trav:

Read Acts. Saul actively opposed the church. He only stopped because Jesus literally used divine intervention to tell him to stop. Yes, Saul had to agree, but he didn't have much choice. Most of us don't receive as personal an "invitation".


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

You wrote: God chooses who will be saved. This decision is made through our obedience to the teachings of Jesus Christ, those which we receive through the Gift of the Holy Spirit. Our hearts are changed, changed through our obedience to the Lords commandments.

God chooses to save us because we keep his commandments? Because we deserve to be saved? This is basically just salvation by works. Paul very specically rejected this:

Ephesians 2:8-9:
For by grace are ye saved through faith, and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
Not of works, lest any man should boast


In particular, Paul himself specifically opposed Christ. Jesus had to drag him in, kicking and screaming.


What Is The Gospel
  
Trav:

You wrote: Clinton, Barry soetoro and Biden. Three recent rejects.

I wrote: When have Obama and Biden committed adultery, or worshiped other gods?

You wrote: you show you are biased to what you prefer rather than truth. ... Who you defend and promote is where you stand.

I asked you point blank, and you quoted my question, then totally ignored it. I wasn't promoting anyone. I was challenging the accusation you, yourself made. I showed how the shoe fits Trump. Can you show how it fits anyone else? Facts, not rhetoric. Again, rejected HOW?

Show SPECIFICALLY where I "call evil good and make excuses for it". Show my EXACT words. Again, false witness.


Do Unsaved Live Forever
  
Trav:

I have no "doctrinal preference", just what scripture says, and does not say. SHOW your "evidence".

I NEVER refused to admit that there were 12 tribes or two houses. You keep twisting what I say into things I never said. What I *DID* say was that by the New Testament, the terms "Jews" was often used **by Jesus and the Apostles** as a synonym for all of Israel, because at that point, there were just three tribes together (Judah, Benjamin, and Levi), and the other 9 had disappeared without a trace after the Babylonian exile, and those three tribes were all that were left.

There is NO evidence whatsoever that the northern tribes somehow magically re-surfaced as some other nation.


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
Ruben:

"Confessing" a sin means to openly declare that you have committed the sin. Penitents who are truly sorry for committing the sin repent and confess. Proud, boastful, and arrogant sinners also openly declare that they committed the sin, so that could also be considered "confession", but they do it out of pride, not repentance.

What counts is repentance - i.e. regret that one has committed the sin, and the desire to stop doing so.


David:

Incorrect. Carefully read how 1+2+3 John and Jude were addressed. These are all letters written to *existing* churches, not to new converts.


What Is The Gospel
  
Trav:

When have Obama and Biden committed adultery, or worshiped other gods?

Rejected how? Clinton and Obama both won two terms. Trump lost his.

Catholic bishops deny Biden communion, NOT for advocating abortion (he's against it), JUST for saying women should have that choice themselves. Hypocritically, they never had problems with Trump who ACTUALLy committed adultery and boasted about it.

I never *DEFENDED* abortion. I show that addressing unwanted pregnancy results in LOWER abortion rates than outlawing abortion, but you never listen.

I never *DEFENDED* gays. Show me ONE post where I did, but you can't.

I am *NOT* a marxist. My parents fled their country because of marxists. Will you never stop LYING?


What Is The Gospel
  
Trav:

Trump:
1) Other gods: Narcissist, worships himself. Name is on every company, every tower.
2) Images: Had own portraits bought at charity's expense. Conventioners knelt to his GOLD STATUE
3) Name in vain: Swears oaths he never keeps*
4) Sabbath: Golfs, never goes to church
5) Parents: Mocked father's Alzheimer's
6) Murder: Said he could kill someone on 5th Ave and not lose supporters*
7) Adultery: Cheated on every wife. Made unwanted advances on married women*. Asked if wrong to be attracted to own daughter
8) Steal: Defrauds contractors*, charities, and cities
9) Perjury: Told 30,000+ lies in office
10) Covet: Whines when others win awards he doesn't, like Nobel prize
(* and BOASTS of these)


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

I keep asking you what you make of 1 John 1:8-10, yet I don't recall you ever answering. Why not?

If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.


This letter was written to already-saved Christians. How do you reconcile the fact that you are perfect, and even they were not? Note that your claim of sinlessness, according to John, means the truth, and His word, are not in you.


Do Unsaved Live Forever
  
Trav:

You wrote: Judah refused Christ1/12.
The Nth House composed of Ten accepted.


And what is your scriptural evidence for this? Yes, the MAJORITY of Judah rejected Jesus (and that also included Benjamin, who stuck with Judah, and also Levi, who were the priesthood, who did also), but there was a remnant of them who DID accept Jesus (i.e. all of Jesus's disciples, and a few pharisees like Nicodemus).

But what evidence do you have that ANY of the northern tribes accepted Christ?


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

Before you can expect others answer your questions, you have yet to answer two questions that were asked of you, namely:

1) Do you know of any Christians who have never sinned, even once, in their entire lives, since they came to Christ? If so, who are they?

and

2) Have you never sinned, even once, in your entire life, since you came to Christ?


Who Are The Children Of Promise
  
David:

Blasphemy against the Holy Spririt is the ONLY unforgivable sin. Be careful when throwing around such accusations.

1 John 1:8-10:
If we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and the truth is not in us.
If we confess our sins, he is faithful and just to forgive us our sins, and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness.
If we say that we have not sinned, we make him a liar, and his word is not in us.

was written to BELIEVERS - who still sinned.

In Christ, we are no longer SLAVES to sin, not that we are incapable of it.

Do you know any Christians anywhere who, after coming to Christ, have never ever sinned for the rest of their lives, not even once? I don't recall ever meeting such a person.


What Is The Gospel
  
Trav:

You wrote: When did you start worrying about a scriptural penalty?

Any time ANYONE claims to speak on God's behalf, and puts words in his mouth.

Since the election of mr evil dud perhaps?

Why beat around the bush? Come out and say it.

Which recent president violated every one of the Ten Commandments, and committed every one of the Seven Deadly Sins - and proudly boasted about it in books and interviews?

Which had an administration so corrupt, it generated twice as many criminal indictments as all other administrations from his own party in the past half century combined, and an order of magnitude more than that of the other party?

I'll leave you to do the math.


What Is The Gospel
  
Trav:

You wrote: Ha. Timothy commands, Christ commands, GOD who created Adam commands you stick a drawer of socks in it. I command you as well false one.

You claim to speak for Christ, God, and Timothy? Who gave you that authority?

You judge her as a "false one"? Who gave you the authority to so judge her. Jesus himself commanded "Judge not, yest ye be judged", but this seems to be yet another one of his inconvenient teachings (like "Thou shalt not bear false witness") that you conveniently and consistently ignore.

The Bible imposes extremely severe penalties for those who claim to speak for God, but say thing he did not command them to say.


What Is The Gospel
  
Trav:

You wrote: Yes because I do know. Simple deduction.

Deduction is YOUR OWN OPINION - the opinion of a man. Opinions may be right, and they may be wrong. You think disagreeing with you is the same as disagreeing with God. This is supreme arrogance, and for the sake of your own soul, you need to stop putting yourself on the same level as God.

I NEVER said "THEY haven't, won't". I'm not saying that branch is gone - only that the wild branch Jesus mentioned was somebody else.

You keep putting words in people's mouths they never said, and then condemning them for it. Please STOP!


Who Are The Masons
  
Trav:

You wrote: Christ fulfilled everything Moses, Psalms and Prophets said about him.

Not all of it. Some of those prophecies are still in the future, e.g. Jesus reigning over Israel.

Jesus himself spoke of his own later return, his second coming, when all those later prophecies would be fulfilled. The Jews rejected him because they did not see this. They expected him to fulfill all the prophecies NOW, and when he didn't, they assumed it was because he was a false prophet.



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