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What Is Rightly Dividing The Word
  
Trav:

You wrote: When scripture makes them angry it is a mark and a sign.

Who is "angry at scripture"? Kathr isn't, and I'm not. While I can't speak for her, what makes me angry is when people ABUSE scripture, by deliberately misinterpreting it and twisting it to say the exact opposite of what it actually says, as you frequently do.

You teach an "Israel-only" doctrine which is different than what has been taught by most Christians all over the world for almost 2000 years, yet you have the arrogance to believe that in two millennia, God would leave all of his believers to wander around in the dark believing a lie, but revealing his true purpose only to you?


What Is Rightly Dividing The Word
  
Trav:

You wrote: Middle wall of division is between the Nth House of Israel and the Sth House.

You are obsessed with the division between houses. It's practically the only thing you ever talk about. NT is not entirely about Israel. It's not mentioned all that often. "Nth House" and "Sth House" are never mentioned by those names at all.

Yes, Israel is part of God's plan, but by obsessing about only that, you ignore his plans for everyone and everything else.

Colossians 1:20
And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself, by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.

Not "just Israel".


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

You wrote: If you believe you have died to sin, Why do you still sin? In reference to (Romans 6:6)

Because I am not perfect.

Why do you think so much of the New Testament talks with how to deal with sin and apostasy in the church? Theoretically, by your reasoning, the church should be totally free of that, yet 2000 years of history have shown us that it is nowhere near that, and the evidence was already there in the NT itself.

Again, for at least the third time, I ask: Do you personally know any Christians who have never sinned, not even once, from the day they were saved until the day of their death?


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

You wrote: Wow. Your obsession against Israel is becoming more clear every post.

As I have repeatedly said (yet you selectively seem to ignore) is that I have NOTHING against Israel. God's plan for Israel is a major part of the Word of God. I have repeatedly agreed with that part of what you have posted.

However, it isn't God's ONLY plan for the world. ALL of Mankind has suffered as a result of Adam's fall, and God has a plan to fix all of that too - yet THAT is something that YOU keep ignoring. Why is that?

What "Crumbs"? There is no part of God's covenant with Israel that says everyone else can and should survive off the crumbs of what God gives Israel.


Church Today In Apostasy
  
Trav:

I was asking David.

Heb 10:16.

Notably absent is the word instantaneously. It says WHAT God will do, not WHEN, nor HOW LONG it will take.

Heb 10:26.

Do you, personally, know ANY Christian ANYWHERE who has never sinned, even once in their entire life, after becoming saved? Because if not, this, taken to its logical conclusion means EVERY Christian who does lead a 100% perfect life after salvation is going to hell.

Eze 37:22

This has to do with kingdoms of Israel, which I know is your favorite subject, but has absolutely nothing to do with salvation and sinlessness, which is the subject being discussed HERE, nor apostasy, which is the topic of this blog.


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

Jesus came to redeem us from sin and death. Why assume the one we can see and verify objectively does not happen during our lifetime, yet other cannot see but must take entirely on faith alone, is instantaneous? Even the healings Jesus did while on earth were not always instantaneous (e.g. the blind man in Mark 8).

We are a reflection of God, but he is immortal, yet we still die, even though we are redeemed from death, so in that, we are not perfect reflections. Paul of reflections said "we see in a glass darkly".

Paul talks about giving milk to new believers instead of meat, lest they stumble - because it's a gradual process, and stumbling is possible.


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

How can you claim the Apostles are yours, when you say they were sent to Israel only, yet you don't even know if you're part of Israel or not?

Why are you so obsessed with prophesies about Israel, when you don't even know if they apply to you?

Obeying, honoring a creators choice is ... My reward is Truth

Obedience to rules to get a promised reward is the very essence of a covenant - which you yourself said ONLY applies to Israel, and since you don't even know if you're part of Israel, you don't know if it even applies to you.

So you just admitted you are part of a covenant, but which one? Be specific.


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

You wrote: Might start making notes why I post Israels Scripture. Their Book, Prophets, Messiah and Apostles. Real simple.

Yes, but that has nothing to do with YOU, since you admitted that you have no idea whether you are part of Israel or not - and you keep insisting that the New Covenant applies to Israel ONLY, so you don't even know if it applies to you at all. So again, why is this so important to YOU?

THEIR Book, Prophets, Messiah, and Apostles, but by your own admission, not YOURS.


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

Jesus came to redeem us from the curse of sin and death. Yet Christians still die, and have been for 2000 years. This means our redemption from death is NOT completed during our lifetime. Why assume his redeeming us from sin is instantaneous, yet his redeeming us from death is obviously not?

Why would the Church need and have mechanisms for dealing with sin and apostasy in its midst, if all of these things were instantaneously done away with the moment one was saved? The reason is that these things are NOT instantaneously done away with the moment one is saved.

Again, how many Christians do you know personally who have never sinned even once, from the day they were saved until their dying day?


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

I never said Luke was an apostle. He was a Greek physician. He was not an apostle, but he DID write the Gospel of Luke, and the Acts of the Apostles, which are inspired scripture. There is no indication that he was "part of Israel scattered all over".

Most? Says who? Can you cite any sources?

According to Understand the Bible: A Reader's Guide and Reference, Harris, 1980 and
Luke the Priest: The Authority of the Author of the Third Gospel, Strelan, 2013, *many* scholars believe he was a Greek physician from Antioch, although *some* think he was Hellenistic Jew.

ALL NT authors obviously spoke Greek.

Why did you pick on the least important comment in my last message, and ignore the rest?


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

You totally missed my point. Jesus died to redeem us from the curses of sin and death. Those people on their deathbeds still died, yes? This means they weren't redeemed from death. Why not? Why assume they were redeemed from things you can't see and can't verify, while it's clear they weren't redeemed from things you CAN see and verify? It's obvious that some parts of the redemption granted by Jesus' death still don't happen within our own lifetimes. Otherwise, why would churches have cemeteries? If Christians were redeemed from death, the world should be full of 2000 year old Christians, but it isn't.


Gospel of 1 Corinthians 15:1-4
  
michael_e

More of the Cornelius story:

Acts 10:
34 Then Peter opened his mouth, and said, Of a truth I perceive that God is no respecter of persons:
35 But in every nation he that feareth him, and worketh righteousness, is accepted with him.

43 To him give all the prophets witness, that through his name whosoever believeth in him shall receive remission of sins.

45 And they of the circumcision which believed were astonished, as many as came with Peter, because that on the Gentiles also was poured out the gift of the Holy Ghost.


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

You wrote (ad-hominem insults removed): Over 60 verses deal with whosoever in Israel.
and Israel is the context genius. Their Book. Their prophets. Their messiah, their Apostles.

Show ONE that deals with BOTH Israel AND whosoever.

Luke was Greek, not Israel.

Yes, that is true of OT, as it was literally written to them. But not NT. It was written to both Israel AND everyone else.

Tell me, why are YOU personally so obsessed with Israel alone? You yourself said that you don't even know if you are part of Israel. So why are you so obsessed with scripture that may not even apply to you in the first place, and a covenant you may not be part of?


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

No, it isn't. NO Old Testament Prophet ever said "whosoever in Israel".
No New Testament apostle ever said "whosoever in Israel".

You are deliberately misrepresenting scripture to push your own agenda that only you believe.

Of course Apostles in Acts 2 addressed men of Israel - because that's who they were talking to at the time. That in no way says God's promise was exclusive to them only. There were other places, like John 3:16, written to everyone in general, where no such qualification applied.

Context, man, context!


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

Jesus freed us from the curses of sin, disease, and death, which we all inherited from Adam. That Christians still get sick, and die (witnessed by church cemeteries for the past two millennia) and even the Apostles gave us rules for how to deal with sins and apostasy within the church demonstrate that none of these were absolute and instantaneous.

Do YOU personally know any Christian who never sins or gets sick, and who is living forever? I sure don't.

So if what you're saying is, indeed, true, this means at least 99.999999% of Christians throughout history have not been saved and redeemed. "I came to save mankind from sin, but that doesn't apply to most of you" is not a particularly appealing gospel.


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

You're STILL ignoring the word "whosoever" which is used in several different scriptures.


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

Through Adam's disobedience, all became SLAVES to sin. Through Jesus' sacrifice, we are no longer SLAVES to sin. We aren't incapable of it, just no longer compelled to do it. 1 John says if we sin, we must confess, and He will forgive us - written to the Church, not unbelievers.

There can be sin without Law. E.g. Adam eating the fruit, Cain murdering Abel even though there was no law against murder at that time.

Some were saying we should sin more to better demonstrate God's grace, but Paul said God forbid!

Unfortunately, many who call themselves Christians believe in "Easy Grace", treating it as a "get out of hell free" card, a license to do whatever they please with no repercussions.


Church Today In Apostasy
  
David:

James 2:10
For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.

If we were currently under the Law, then we would be required to live 100% sinless lives from the moment we were saved until death. Even one single slip-up of the tiniest kind, and it would be just as bad as if we had committed mass murder.

To claim that one is totally sinless is to try to justify oneself according to the Law.

We would be total slaves to the Law. Jesus died to free us from slavery to the Law.


How To Rebuke Evil
  
Trav:

John 3:16
For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life.

This does not say "For God so loved Israel", nor "whosoever of Israel believeth in him". These refer to everyone, whether they are of Israel or not.



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