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Pentecostal Church Our Model
Cherry picking verses out of Ezekiel 36 doesn't prove the earthly kingdom reign had begun. A careful reading of Ezekiel 36 would be seeing the whole chapter fulfilled, as it is steeped in prophecy concerning many things that were not dependent on man, as you read , there is no "IF YOU WILL, THEN I WILL" . NO, it's exclusively God saying many times "I WILL, I WILL, I WILL. "

Yet Hyper-dispensationalists insist God had to call of the earthly kingdom, leaving all these first century Jews hanging in limbo excluding them from the BOC .....all because Israel ,AS A WHOLE failed to cooperate, and God had to go to plan B, giving Paul a new Gospel of salvation that accompanied the Holy Spirit for other Jews. Nonsense!

Predestined As A Son Of God
Samuel, the way to pinpoint a Cult is to see if it EXCLUDES anyone, and somehow it's all about THEM being picked.

Predestined here in scripture means THE CHURCH, THOSE SAVED TODAY DURING THIS AGE OF GRACE, God has predetermined the BOC is to be conformed to the image of Jesus Christ, being accomplished through the fellowship of His sufferings, which is what the preaching OF THE CROSS is all about. This in a nut shell is explained in Colossians 1:24-27, Roman's 6-8,Galatians 2:20-21.

Those who fail to see this are simply trying to climb over some other way.

Keep The Sabbath Holy
ANY WORK including cooking on the sabbath defiled the sabbath. No one today can keep a day HOLY exactly as God laid down THE LAW in the OT. Interestingly enough there are no NT SABBATH LAWS. Yet, those who think they are keeping the Sabbath as God wanted in the OT UNDER THE LAW cannot replicate this today, are kidding themselves. You can't kid God. He sees you're not keeping the sabbath, which also included stoning to death those who did not.


THE CHURCH IS CHRIST HIMSELF. When we enter in, we are actually entering into Jesus Christ, baptized into Christ. IN CHRIST WE ARE HOLY, BECAUSE HE IS HOLY. We've been raised up together with Him where there are no days, nights, etc.

Pentecostal Church Our Model
Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Actually no the jews who came every year to pentecost was a yearly activity. It was not some special moment for the Kingdom restored to Israel to begin. Jesus made that clear in Acts 1:6-7.

ALSO how exactly was this Kingdom restored to Israel to begin seeing they rejected Jesus as Lord AND KING. If the Kingdom was to begin then Jesus would have shown Himself to ALL just as Zechariah 12-14 states. When Jesus returns to restore the Kingdom, they will see Him and His wounds, and they will mourn. We see that didn't happen in Acts.

Pentecostal Church Our Model
Acts 2:47
Praising God, and having favour with all the people. And the Lord added to the church daily such as should be saved.

Acts 2:47 does not say "added into them". It says THE LORD ADDED TO THE CHURCH. There is no scriptures to support the Lord is adding anyone to the KINGDOM COME ON EARTH scenario. ONE should rightly divide wording here. Plus Jesus would be reigning on earth if that were so.

WE also see in acts 20 Paul shows Pentecost didn't end in Acts 1 with Jews. This would be several years after this supposed Kingdom Come had come....proving hyper -dispensationslism makes no sense. We're they STILL waiting for the earthly kingdom reign?

Pentecostal Church Our Model
When rightly dividing the word of truth, we see the Holy Spirit was promised to ALL FAMILIES... re Gentiles too. This is explained in Galatians.

And we see both Jew and Gentile given the Holy Spirit. As a matter of fact, Paul asked a group, "have you received the Holy Spirit since you believed"?. Interestingly these were Jews who said, " we have not heard of any Holy Spirit".

Question, Was Paul guilty of preaching two different Holy Spirits? And if this same Holy Spirit indwelt all believers re Cornelius, where does scripture clearly state these are two entirely different churches.

However Ephesians clearly show that middle wall was taken down, MAKING ONE NEW MAN IN CHRIST AKA THE CHURCH..

Pentecostal Church Our Model
If receiving the Holy Spirit , which began the Church AGE, is not the Church today, my question is, 1) do hyper-dispensationslists believe ANOTHER SPIRIT is forming the Church, 2) do hyper-dispensationalists reject the indwelling of the Holy Spirit as evidence of salvation, 3) did Paul preach ANOTHER HOLY SPIRIT? when?

Or do hyper-didpensationalists believe the Holy Spirit is divided?

When God established THE CHURCH in Acts 2, and gave miracles as signs and wonders to the Apostles PROVING the Church age began then, as Hebrews 1-2 clearly explain, is it the Hyper-dispensationalists today who are void of the Holy Spirit?

Confessing Our Sins
Bill, I see that verse differently. I see Jews who knew their scriptures state only God can forgive sin. And I believe myself only God THROUGH JESUS CHRIST can forgive sin. This is why Jesus died for our sin. No human can die for my sin in forgiving my sin. This is also why the pharisees were all riled up, seeing they THOUGHT a Meer man was forgiving sin, something only God can do. This is also why they crucified Jesus, believing Jesus WAS blaspheming God doing something only God can do, not realizing JESUS WAS GOD ON THE FLESH.

Now yes we are to forgive one another. But my forgiving someone does not override God.

I believe for our own sakes we are to forgive one another.

Living In The End Times
Just wondering why America and what goes on here is the determinating factor of when God decides its time for His return. Matthew 24-25, Zechariah 12-14 has nothing to do with America.

Interesting some folks think everything revolves around America. I hate to disappoint, but there was no mention of AMERICA when Revelation was written. America or even a hint of an America is nowhere in scripture. Also there are no prophetic scriptures that God canceled His promises to the Nation of Israel and gave it to a Gentile nation( AMERICA).

The gospel of AMERICA is a false Gospel. Christians all around the world are not told to LOOK TO AMERICA FOR SIGNS OF END TIMES PROPHECY.

Living In The End Times
According to Trav, Jesus was sent ONLY to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. Trav definition of the Lost sheep of the house of Israel are only certain tribes of Israel, seeing he believes in the two house theory. Trav also believes the house of Israel are Gentiles.

This is problematic, seeing Jesus said DO NOT GO TO THE GENTILES, but only to the lost sheep of the House of Israel. Now what about the other HOUSE. Trav says Judah, Benjamin etc are NOT the House of Israel, but the House of Judah.

And do we see Jesus asking for identification as to what tribe any belong to first before seeking them out? No Judah, Levite or Benjamin were sought out?

Keep The Sabbath Holy
I try to keep every day Holy, not just one. Understanding Hebrews 3-4, I've "entered in" God's rest, where everyday is Holy.

If I obeyed the OT resting on a day, re, then the 7th, from sundown to sundown, with ALL that was instructed to obey , including being stoned to death for disobeying the sabbath LAW, and laws that accompanied, I think we see not even sabbath kerpers actually keep and obey the sabbath. Nor do we see any NT stonnings for not keeping the OT SABBATH. and I don't see any NEW RULES for A NT SABBATH except we now ENTER INTO HIS REST taking on a whole new meaning. The OT was an outward show, NT REST is to enter into HIS DEATH AND RESURRECTION LIFE...I AM CRUCIFIED WITH CHRIST, NO LONGER I BUT CHRIST IN ME.

Living In The End Times
Even if one believes the Bible was written by Jews/ Israel, not all things written are exclusively about Israel. Take Nineveh for example. This shows God's grace and kindness towards HEATHANS who were not Jews or Israel.

And what's interesting, Jesus makes a comment that one day Nineveh will rise up and condemn Israel...Matthew 12:41.

Nineveh repented. Those not even Jews or Israel repented.

So why was Jonah sent to the heathen in the OT?

Because Israel was to be a LIGHT TO ALL NATIONS OF THIS WORLD.

Pentecostal Church Our Model
I guess if all they watched is Christian Satellite channels.???No they are not my model.

Curious why someone would think they are our model today? Who is "OUR"? "Our" as in America? The Gospel of the heavenly LOTTO? That may be the gospel of apostate America, but not true Christ centered, cross centered Christians. They have the OPPOSITE MESSAGE of Christianity. But maybe with so many false politicians who have no shame in lying, it runs hand in hand with false churches. Listen, if we can't discern truth from lies in our politicians, why would these same folks be able to discern truth from lies from the pulpit?

The anti_Christ will be the biggest liar of all and MULTITUDES will believe and follow.

Forgive As God Forgives
Just as God IN CHRIST forgave you.

There is a lesson in one of the Gospels where someone owing a debt was forgiven, ( I'm just recalling from memory) but then when the shoe was on the other foot, this same person who was forgiven refused to forgive another.

It might be worth revisiting that verse and it's consequences.

Those who know what it's like having God's forgiveness, something NONE OF US DESERVE, should never hold unforgivness towards another we think they don't deserve.

Living In The End Times
Imposters reveal themselves by their distaste for any mention of Israel or sheep. Thank GOD for his confirming words of for ever and everlasting. ////

This is a total lie. I dont know anyone who has a distaste for scripture referring to Israel. But there are certain cults who continually show a distaste for any scripture referring to Gentile, Greek, Heathen , much like the Mormons use these terms as a derogatory insult towards those who are not Mormon, seeing they too consider themselves Israel.

God has concluded ALL under sin, and ALL need to repent regardless of your DNA.

And once you have repented and are saved you are no longer a Jew or Israel or Gentile, bond or free, male or female, but A NEW CREATURE IN CHRIST.

Confessing Our Sins
Strongaxe, exactly. An unwanted pregnancy out of wedlock would be sin in God's eyes. The pregnancy doesn't disappear when we ask for forgiveness. We still suffer the consequences for our actions.

If we lie this is sin. We need to confess and ask God for forgiveness. We also need to go to the person we lied to to ask forgiveness. We don't need to then go to a Catholic priest asking again for forgiveness. We don't need to stand up and confess in front of the whole church. I believe James 5:16... TO GO TO ONE ANOTHER, is not group confession. If I go to you and you to me, if there was a problem, that is to one another. That verse shows no group confession or a church setting. Man has read too much into that verse.

Confessing Our Sins
So Ruben, are you saying Jesus was only a man?

You never answered my question. Let me ask this way. When you sin, do you go straight to God and ask forgiveness, or do you run to a man and get forgiveness?

Now I've asked friends to forgive me if I've hurt or offended them, BUT I also seek God's forgiveness first. And if my friend won't forgive, I still have God's forgiveness. I may have lost a friend, but I can never lose my relationship with God.

Perhaps the RCC doesn't understand what having a personal relationship with the Lord is about????

Confessing Our Sins
Ruben, question..Let's say someone horribly murdered the child next door. And let's say the man asked God for forgiveness,and received it, but the neighbor refused yo forgive. Is the man's sin forgiven or not?

Jesus does say we are to forgive one another. And I believe this is what Paul is referencing on 2 Corinthians 2:10. I do not believe Paul is teaching Church Doctrine on forgiveness of sin. I believe he's teaching personal forgiveness of another and Paul says if they are forgiving this issue, then he is too, so all are in unity.

When we just use one verse wonders , we can create any church doctrine we want. I dont do that or believe that way.

Confessing Our Sins
Ruben, as I've said before, picking a verse here and there out of context and not applying THE WHOLE WORD OF GOD, is dangerous. Men cannot forgive sin. Only God can, and it's based solely on the sacrifice of His Son. Without personal faith in Jesus death and resurrection for the forgiveness of sin, there is no forgiveness of sin man can do to go around that.

I believe those verses mean we, spirit filled Christians who are forgiven have authority to preach the Gospel to the lost so that they too can find forgiveness from God through Jesus Christ. THIS IS THE MINISTRY OF RECONCILISTION.

Ruben, for your own sake, I pray you have found forgiveness from God, not man.

Confessing Our Sins
Bill, absolutely. And knowing we are the Body of Christ, we all are working together for good within the body of Christ. All our gifts are to also minister to one another. This is the only way it makes sense to me.

Great question. I think the healing then is a healing within the whole body of Christ,and a healing of the whole body of Christ, those IN CHRIST. There's another verse that says if one suffer we ALL suffer.

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